In this episode of the Impostor Syndrome Files, we talk about self-awareness. Most of us don’t know ourselves as well as we think we do. Self-awareness is hard work. It requires time we might think we don’t have. It might mean facing some truths that scare us. But self-awareness is critical to our self-trust and self-empowerment. This week, I talk with Zovig Garboushian, an executive coach, speaker and trainer, about the ways in which self-awareness unlocks our power and puts us back in charge of our own lives.
About My Guest
Zovig Garboushian is the fiery force behind Boldness Ablaze Coaching and Zovig Speaks. She's an Executive Coach, Speaker, and Trainer with nearly 25 years of experience in marketing, people, and organizational development. She focuses on providing learning and development opportunities that tap into your head, heart, and intuition, and combines practical insight with answers to the intangible questions of life. She's worked with leaders and their teams at AT&T, Google, Microsoft, Southern New Hampshire University, University of Delaware, Bungie Games, Pivotal Ventures, and more. Her home base is Seattle, Washington, and she works with clients worldwide.
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Connect with Zovig:
Email: info@boldnessablaze.com
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Transcript
Kim Meninger
Welcome, Zovig. It's wonderful to have you here today. I'm excited to jump in. And before we get into the meat of the conversation, I'd love to invite you to introduce yourself. Tell us a little bit about you.
Zovig Garboushian
Yeah, thank you, Kim. So, I’m Zovig Garboushian, I am the founder of Boldness Ablaze Coaching and as well as Zovig.com. I'm a speaker. I'm an executive coach. And I'm an organizational consultant. So I work with companies through change. And I do a lot of management training and helping both new and seasoned managers, people managers learn and unlearn the things that helps them be better with the people that they lead. And I have, I've been, I've been in the professional development and personal development work for the last 10 years, but the first 15 years of my career, were in media and marketing. And that was a lesson in being really, really good at something but not being connected to it at all. So there was a lot of a lot that I learned through that experience about who I was and who I was not. And it took a lot for me to figure out a way to move out of that. So I could start doing something that was more congruent with who I am and what I cared about. And so in my work, now, I work with a lot of leaders, executive leaders, people, managers who are trying to be we use the word authentic, a lot, right in this world. But when they're trying to be authentically confident, and authentic leaders, meaning that the way they feel on the inside, is reflected by the actions they take on the outside. So that's what I mean when I say authentic. And, and really, my core work and foundation is about helping people become more connected to who they are. So they have access to change the things that aren't working for them, and then create the things that they do.
Kim Meninger
Oooh, I love it. And I want to go back, if it's okay with you, I want to start with a story because a lot of things come up for me when you talk about wanting something that's more congruent with who you are. And I think that there's so many people out there who feel caught in that trap, right? You may be good at something you may have invested a lot in your education or experience. And it sort of feels like Well, I'm stuck here now. And you almost also face certain identity challenges, too, and thinking about making move to something else. Like, maybe I'm giving up some status, or maybe I'm going to potentially disappoint the people around me. And like when you think back on your journey, how did you grapple with some of the fears and inherent self-doubt that comes with thinking? This isn't the right place for me?
Zovig Garboushian
Yeah, I love that you say the word identity, because I think that's a really big one. I know, it was big for me. And I know it's big for many of the people that I work with. I had 15 years of experience going down this path, right? I got really, really good at it. I was efficient. I was smart. I was I wasn't the best marketer, but I was the one who hustled the hardest. So I didn't you know what I mean? So that was how I made up for it. And I learned to identify myself as a marketer. I didn't know how to think of myself outside of those terms. I also worked for Time Warner, that was where I spent a lot of my time, you know, my 11 years of my career was at that company, different magazines, different websites, different brands. So these were big, stable, supposedly, at the time, right, stay nothing stable, but they seem stable, secure, predictable, the paycheck showed up the benefits were there, you know, I had natural community that I worked with. So all of those things felt like this is the safe thing, this is the right thing. And so you're going along this path, you're investing all the time you're learning, you're getting better, you're rising, and I was rising. And it's hard. It was hard to say one Well, who am I every time I would go to look for a new job, I would just look for marketing roles. Because I didn't know what else to seek out. Because I didn't know who I was beyond that. And so I, I remember thinking myself, man, you know, I could just keep applying for this stuff. And then I would be my boss. And that's just not that doesn't feel right. I always felt better being the number two because then I didn't have to, I had a buffer between me and the higher, higher-ups, right? I was like, I don't want to deal with that. And I knew that and I knew enough about myself in that way. But I thought, well, if I'm not wanting to deal with that I'm not wanting to get up there. What does that mean about me? And I had to look at how I was relating to myself and who I understood myself to be. Now I had a, you know a gift given to me from the universe. I was laid off twice. I didn't learn the lesson the first time, but I learned it the second time. And for me, I realized layoffs, layoffs are different experiences for everyone. So I don't want to make any assumptions. But for me, I had a little bit of savings. And so I had a little bit of time that I didn't feel like I had to rush to find something and I could take some time I'm. And what I did was that was the first time I started working with a coach. It was not the first time I had done any self-reflection or digging I have, I've been in some form of therapy coaching, self-development, professional development for 25 years. But that was the first time I've worked with a coach. And what we worked on was what my values were when it came to work. And that was something I had never actually thought about. Because, like you said, we go to school, we invest in our education, we get these degrees, and then who are we going to let down? What are we going to let go of what did we do wrong? If we decide to change our path? Like all those stories we have about ourselves, like I made a mistake? How can I just give all of this up, it's too late, it's too late for me. And I got to face all of that when I worked with this coach. And I understood what my values were, from a professional standpoint, and one was that I wanted to own something and have not just be executing someone else's vision. And the other was that I wanted to be in a place where professional and personal development were the thing that we did. That was the product we provided. Neither of those had anything to do with marketing. And I was going along and I was doing some fun freelance work. And I was working for a small career website. It was a job board. And they had online courses, and they were beefing things up and I heard in Hall in the hallway. We're looking for Director of Education, and I thought, Oh, my, my spidey sense went out my ears perked up. It was like, you know, like, like a cartoon puppy. And. And I raised my hand, and I said, I would like that. And they said, That's interesting because you are a marketer. I said, I know. But I don't want to do that anymore. And so that was my pivot. So it was fortunate right time, right place, but also it would have gone in one ear and out the other had I not done the work to connect with what I wanted. And yeah, it is, it can be a scary proposition. Now I at the time was single. So I didn't have a family. I didn't have children. I it was just me. So I had some more freedom, right? But I also think that you don't have to just quit if you want to make a change. You can come up with a phased approach. You can come up with a timeline you can you can find ways to do it responsibly. and face the, the what ifs and the Who am eyes, and what if this doesn't work, and all of those kinds of questions. Because they will come up and it's, it's natural, it's human, it's normal. When we are in a place of uncertainty, and we don't know the outcome, it is natural and normal to have fear or worry or unsure, unsure sadness. But we always have a choice. We can stay where we are. Where we can choose to turn toward the uncertainty and see what's there. There's always a choice to to, to turn back, I can always go back right, I can always go back to working for a company always. But, but I'm always a choice. And for me at that point, I was so misaligned with who, who I was I was I could see it. Once I've done the work of seeing my values, what I was doing just did not match at all, they were so far apart. And I had to honor that.
Kim Meninger
I love that. And, you know, it's as you're talking, what I'm thinking about is, if this was true for me, too, I worked in high tech for the first half of my career. And, you know, I would argue I did a good job and a you know, it was fine. But it wasn't in alignment with who I am. And so there was always this feeling of is this it right like this? [Yes.] Is it and, and I feel like the, the self-doubt was stronger because I was kind of forcing myself to learn and care about things that I just wouldn't guess then.
Zovig Garboushian
And then oh, the faking of it. Oh, my goodness, the energy league of faking that you cared?
Kim Meninger
Exactly. But I think the challenge that you're describing, too, is that, as humans, we are wired to avoid danger and uncertainty translates to danger in our blades. And so a lot of us know that where we are now is not the best fit, but we don't know what to move towards. So if you don't know what to move towards, then the comfort zone however miserable it is, is the safest place to be right. So you'll stay there for a long time until you do the work that you're describing to figure out. Who am I and what is the right path for me?
Zovig Garboushian
Yeah, yeah, I love everything you said so many good things, the faking of it. I remember, you know, being around the conference table and the weekly sales calls. We just scored this new client people were cheering I'm like, really? This is what we're excited about. Good. Never get excited about it. I had to fake it a lot. And that's an energy leak. Because it is a massive emotional and mental energy leak when we have to fake interest in what we're doing. But the, the experience of doing that kind of digging, and doing that kind of self-reflective work and with this with this was a coach, this was what she was trained to do, right? So we saw that it was really, really valuable for me to do that kind of work. But if, if we don't know who we are, then we have to go find out. If you don't know what you want, isn't it worth it to find out? I mean, we live in our bodies our entire lives, and yet we are the last people we get to know. And that to me is an outrage. Right? Prioritizing us ourselves, our needs, what we care about what we want. That is a learning that is a learned act, especially with women. Because I was not trained to articulate what I wanted. I was trained to, you know, put your head down, do your work. And it was to keep me safe. It wasn't because people were nobody was trying to make me miserable. It was to keep me safe to make sure that like I went to school, I did my stuff. And I was I was safe. And here's the thing, though, often we are not in danger. And what you said about you translates to danger. I think our brains and our emotions get really mixed up like, Ah, this is danger. It's not you. We are in charge at all times, even when things go haywire. Even when things go off the rails, not what we wanted, this is not what I chose, you still have choice and how you respond to it. Always. Acceptance is part of life and accepting things that are not our preference is grown up stuff. But we can move through it. Right? And so we're not in I'm not I wasn't in danger. And if I had to if I had to hustle and go find work because I needed to pay the rent, and I couldn't I would have found it, I would have done it. I had I think part of this is self-trust, having your own back, like knowing that whatever happens, I have my back, I can land on my feet, I will figure this out.
Kim Meninger
Yeah, that's such an important point. I think the self-trust is absolutely critical because you won't be able to see the other side yet. [Right.] But you can trust that you can handle it when you get there.
Zovig Garboushian
Yeah, I love that you say that. Because I often use this analogy. I think it's an analogy, I get analogy and metaphor mixed up. But I think it's an analogy might be a metaphor. So we often will set our goals, if you're like looking at a horizon line, right, you're staring out at the horizon line on a beach or something, we set our goals just before the horizon line. So it's not so far off that we can't see it. But it's just far enough that we feel like we're moving somewhere. Like I'm doing stuff, I'm going I have my goals, it's over there, I'm going toward it, it's a far away, and I'm gonna get there. But those goals that we set before the horizon line are, it's just stuff we've done before. It's just another version of something I've done before, if I had stayed in my marketing director role, the next position might have been a VP of marketing, I kind of was already doing VP of marketing stuff. It wasn't so new, it wasn't. So it wasn't such a stretch for me to just get promoted to the next level of marketing. Right? That's a goal before the horizon line. What's beyond the horizon line is the stuff you don't exactly know how it's gonna work out. But you trust yourself enough to know that when I get there, I will figure it out. Because I want to, because I deserve it, because it's meaningful. Because if I don't, what are my options?
Kim Meninger
I love that and that really syncs up with my, the way that I think about even just having confidence and overcoming self-doubt, is trusting yourself and believing in yourself does not mean having all the answers. It does not being perfect, right? It means knowing you can handle it. [Right.] You, you have lived life long enough to have figured out how to tackle problems. I'll figure this one out too.
Zovig Garboushian
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. It's like it's almost like when we, you know, in when we talk about ourselves, it's like, we're talking about someone else that's driving the car and not us. Well, what if I, what if I can't do this? And what if this happens? It's like, well, you're, you're driving the car. I'm always driving my car. No one else is I'm not letting you letting other people into your driver's seat. I remember I watched oh, gosh, I don't remember what it was, what I was watching, but it was like a Q&A, right? And someone in the audience stood up and said, Should I be worried if and I can't even remember what she was worried about. But the key of that was should I be worried if and the person on stage said, is that your preference to worry? And it was such a simple response that it just kind of hit her like, oh, no, it's not my preference to worry. It's not my preference to, to not be on my own side. It's not, it's not my preference to have self-doubt. And so I think we can choose those things. And sometimes it's habit for me to doubt myself, sometimes it's a habit for me to assume that it's not going to work. But I think the thing that gets us out of those, Kim, is our connection to ourselves. It's self-awareness. It's the relationship that we have with ourselves, the deeper relationship we have with ourselves, the more connected to who we are, and who we know ourselves to be, the faster we can get out of those moments because it is not about never having self-doubt, I am a human being, I will feel those things that is natural, it is not, you know, in a new situation where I'm the only woman or I'm this, you know, it's totally new for me, feeling that imposter experience. That's a natural thing. How long I stay in it is up to me. It's not about never feeling those things. It's about how long I stay there. If I'm going to believe the top track of like, oh, you're not as good. You're not you know, you're not as capable. You're new. I'm new at this. So I'm not that good. I'm just going to keep quiet. No. New is great. No means you have more freedom to ask dumb questions that will like reveal things that people who know too much are overlooking. So, you know, it's not about never experiencing the doubt. You're human. It is about how long you stay there. And some people can stay there for years. Because they don't know. What else is, what they're what else there is. Yeah, so it's the relationship that we have with ourselves that self-awareness is the key. It's, it's the antidote to self-doubt.
Kim Meninger
Can you talk a little bit about impostor syndrome and how it fits into your work? Not necessarily personally but in what you see?
Zovig Garboushian
Yeah, I mean, I see a lot of, you know, let me just say I work with a lot of high-level powerful. By powerful I mean, they have influence in their roles. Women, I work with men as well. So these people have influence from the outside, they appear confident, and they are it's not like they're faking everything, you know, there. But there are moments each of them have their specific moments where that imposter and by the way, I don't love the word imposter because I don't think any of us are fakes are for frauds. But there's, I don't, I can't come up with a better term yet. So let's just use that term. So they're having there are moments that trigger their impostor, whether that's the CFO, who's the only woman and every quarter, she does the board meeting, and it's a bunch of men. She's so powerful, and she knows her stuff. But in that meeting, the imposter stuff comes up, right? That's the, that's the circumstance which sort of triggers that for her, you're new in a place, you're the new kid on the block, you are the only person, right? You are the perfectionist who is like afraid to hit send on the email, because one thing could be wrong. One thing the comma could be out of place, you might have missed a number like, you know, so we all have certain flavors of this stuff. And it shows up, it shows up differently, but also the same. It shows up differently, but also the same, I'm not sure about myself in this. And I see that as like, let's learn, let's tighten the connection between you and the trust that you have in who you are. And that even if you are not liked, if you are disagreed with if you are turned away, it doesn't diminish who you are, because you get to decide who you are. And I know that this is not a new message, right? This is out on there. I mean, look at any Instagram account, like, you know, this is the stuff that's out there in memes. But I think we take it, it sort of goes by our eyes, we're so used to seeing it now that if we stop to think about, I get to decide who I am, what I'm worth, and the value of my expertise. If it is not welcome in this place, this is not the place for me. I need to find a way to find another place. That might take me six months that might take me two days. But that means I get to choose to be in this experience. And so the self-trust is a big one I think that we work on when it comes to feeling that imposter experience and also just debunking what's causing it because I don't think it's we're not fakes or frauds. Right? We're not faking or trying to pull the wool over anybody's eyes. I think we're in situations that can cause unsure it. I don't know if unsureness is a word but let's just say unsure this lack of self-assurance. And I think that's a very human experience. So I think we can mix up being unsure with feeling like a fraud.
Kim Meninger
Yes, yes.
Zovig Garboushian
Somewhere along the way, someone coined the term imposter syndrome that, that term has been around for decades. There was research done on have it done on it, most of it was done on women. So I feel like the research was skewed, because there are a lot of men, I've coached them that have felt that way. It's not just women. But in and then we glommed on to it, because we like fun marketing words, right? That's a marketing term, I will tell I'm debunking it for everybody. It's a marketing term. The experience beneath it is a real experience. But I think it comes from our personal experiences, the environments that we're in, and how those environments feed into the other. You don't belong here. Because of how you look, because of what you know, because of what you don't know, because of who you are, whatever. And it's a shame that we have environments that do that. And we do. And I think in those environments, that stuff can rise to the top a lot more freely. And so it's our job to rein it in. And or leave the environment.
Kim Meninger
Yeah, and I love that you said that because I think personal power is so important to this conversation, because for me, when I think about impostor syndrome, if you boil it down, it's really just anxiety, right? It's fear. It's yeah, yeah, bad is going to happen. We don't know what. But it manifests itself, just like you said, and all these different ways of, I'm a perfectionist, or I'm a people pleaser, or I'm all these different things, because I'm afraid of some imagined or even in the circumstance, you're describing maybe that I fear that because I've been taught to expect that because it's the environment that I operate in. But at the core of it is the power you have to decide whether or not this is where do you want to be? Right? So the self-trust piece is the work we all do throughout our lives. [Yeah.] But then in any given situation, we get to decide does this situation work for me.
Zovig Garboushian
Right. Right. And, if it doesn't, and you have the means and the ability to lead it right away, great. And if you need to create a plan to get out in you know, certain amount of time, excellent, whatever, whatever we do what we got to do, but nothing is stuck. And nothing. We are not stuck. And we are not static. We're not meant to be stuck in static we as people are ever-evolving.
Kim Meninger
Yes, absolutely. I think that's such, such an important point. And I wonder if you have thoughts because you talked about sort of therapy and coaching, which are obviously really great. [Sure.] You know, forums for the kind of work that we're talking about. I know there are people out there that are thinking I don't have time for this, right? Like there's always the time factor like oh, yeah, kids, and I've got a job and how do we make this? Sustainable?
Zovig Garboushian
Yeah, yeah. So I mean, therapy and coaching are not the only ways that we're able to connect with ourselves, right? There are podcasts like this one, there are that that podcast? Yes, you have, maybe I might say something, one thing that just like, make something click for someone and go, Oh, I didn't think about it that way. Those are learning moments. Those are reflective moments that what we're talking about is having a forum in which to do reflective work. Coaching and therapy are a very structured forum, right? But there are other forums to do that, read a book, find a podcast, watch a video. I mean, there sit down for 10 minutes every morning and write, what am I what am I excited about today? What am I worried about today? And why am I worried about it? If you write with a pen, if that's possible for you, and you can do that I know some people that, you know, my hand stutters. And there's all kinds of reasons. But if you can write with your hand, or just write at all, it will get your brain working in, in a way that sort of releases information you didn't expect to show up. I know for me when I'm writing stuff comes out, and then I go, Whoa, I didn't. Didn't think about that. Right. So if you give yourself a little structured reflection, every morning for 10 minutes, I'm going to sit and write down what am I excited about? What do I want to create today? What am I worried about? Why am I worried about this? Who do I want to be? What do I want to bring? Well, I mean, there's a million prompts that we can do to connect with ourselves and then answer it, honestly. And in the moments where you notice yourself getting uncomfortable with what's coming out, work through it. Writing, you know, people, you can meditate. And by meditate. It doesn't have to be intimidating. You're not supposed to clear your mind. That's like level 10 meditation. Meditation is just sitting for five minutes and being quiet. And maybe just listening to your breathing. It's giving yourself a mantra to say over and over and over again. Today I will be creative. Today I will be creative over and over and over. I mean, meditation doesn't have to be hard. Under inaccessible there are in and there are ways to reflect with other people, a good friend of good trusted colleague who won't pull punches with you. You can ask them, What do you see? What did you see about me in that meeting? What worked? What didn't work? How could I have done that differently? Get invite feedback. These are all free and easy ways that take very little time to reflect. We just need to find ways to put a mirror in our own face. That's what this work is about. Just find a way to put a mirror in your own face and know that whatever is there is not that scary.
Kim Meninger
Yes. And it becomes scarier, the more you avoid it, right?
Zovig Garboushian
Oh, my goodness. It's like the monster that just gets bigger and bigger in the closet. Right? But not that scary. My gosh, we've had, we've had children, we've built businesses, we've done all these things like do you think a fake or a fraud could do those things? No.
Kim Meninger
Exactly? Exactly. No, you're absolutely right. And I think, you know, sort of going back to where we started with realizing that maybe you're not in the right place for you, whether that's career-wise, whether that's just functionally whatever it might be, right? I have, unfortunately, worked with and talk to so many people who plow through their physical and emotional experiences. And to the point at which they break down, right, something happens, they get sick, they have to take a mental health leave, something catches up with them. And I think what you're talking about too, and getting to know yourself is just listening to your body, listening to the news, right? That come because your body knows things right or not. So quick to just dismiss like, Oh, I've been really tired lately. I just need to drink more coffee, or I haven't been feeling well. I am just gonna, you know, ignore it and keep plowing through.
Zovig Garboushian
Yeah. Yeah, the body that love that you brought up the body. That's another way of reflection. If we stop to slow down and listen to what our bodies are telling us, because they know the body, there's a book, it's called the Body Keeps the Score, I think I have not read the book. But I can tell you that I already love the book, because the body does keep the score. The body knows what's up. For me, I had stomach issues. For years, my stomach was telling me something. And then I was one of those people that got very sick. I developed Graves disease and hyperthyroidism, and it took me down hard. And I had a five-year recovery period from that. And I was not paying attention. I was not paying attention. I was feeling it. I knew it was happening. But I wasn't listening, the body will tell you everything for me. In the times, you know, there were moments where I know that if, if I'm really, really upset by something like I'm talking on a core in your bones level upset about something, my throat will start to close up. That's telling you that that's a sign for me, I can get a tension headache. After I've had an experience of being anxious about something, I will get a tension headache from it. Right. So the body will tell you what's going on if we stop to pay attention. But I don't know where we got this idea that like plowing through things meant you are strong. Or not being able to name an emotion means that you're strong. I, I don't know where that came from. But the awareness of having an emotion what that emotion is naming it helps us move through it. [Yeah.] If I, you know, oh, gosh, my, my back is really killing me today. Like what's going on? If I stopped for two minutes to ask myself what's going on? I might find that I'm stressed about this, or I'm worried about that, or you know, and it's once I name it, I can address it. But if I don't name it, you're going on with a sickness that you haven't. You're just dealing with symptoms, but you don't know how to treat yourself.
Kim Meninger
That's right. That's exactly right. And that's how I think about impostor syndrome, too, is that if you're just living in this chronic state of self-doubt, there's nothing you can do about that. Right? I personally have struggled with anxiety my entire life. And when I get into an anxious spiral, not problem-solving, right? I'm just ruminating and worrying constantly. And you have to be able to say, what's the actual problem? What am I actually worried about? Right? What is it that I'm afraid of? And then once you can name it to your point, now I can address it and I can come up with a plan, whatever that plan is, like you said, it could be a short-term plan. It could be a longer-term plan but at least it puts me back in that driver's seat as you were talking about before.
Zovig Garboushian
Yeah. Yeah. There are some, some of those emotional experiences are a lot more powerful and stronger than others. And I also want to say, I am not necessarily referring to the emotions that might come along with trauma, or something devastating that can happen in our lives. Those are complex. Those are deep. Those take time off When I'm talking about emotions, I'm talking about our day-to-day stuff, the day-to-day experiences of living and working and being with people and having families and in all of that, I think we have a lot more say in how we respond to our lives than we give ourselves credit for. But if I refer to myself as I am, a I'm an anxious person, I'm a control freak, I am a type A, I am a people pleaser, you bet your ass you're going to, you're going to walk right into that and live that to the nth degree, you will show up that way you will follow that narrative, you will live that script, it will be who you are. So start by changing the language. experiencing anxiety, that's real. It's not that it's not real. It's very real. I experience anxiety. I have in the past, have a tendency to people, please. I have in the past have a tendency to want to control things. There's a tendency of mine, but it's not who I am. I believe that that is what I am, I will live into it. I guarantee you, I will live into it.
Kim Meninger
That's such an important point. I'm so glad you said that. Because it brings up a couple of points, right? It's the idea that we tie that our identity to this narrative, but also language matters, right? [Language matters.] And your brain I always joke like your brain is not a fact checker. Right? Your brain believes your palate. Keep, keep telling yourself, you're a perfectionist, your brains gonna show up that way.
Zovig Garboushian
That's right. Yeah, yeah, it's we're not stuck in these narratives. Even though it feels like we are. I have full agency over me. In fact, I am the only thing I really have full agency over, I don't have agency over other things, other people, other situations, I can be in more predictable experiences. But even those the rug can get pulled out from under me at any time. All I have is how I respond. And I would like to speak about myself and talk about myself to myself in a kind and compassionate way. I'm new here. So I don't know as much. So I'm going to feel a little unsure for a time. This is not a permanent state. And it does not mean that I am a fake or a fraud. It just means I'm new here. And I don't know everything.
Kim Meninger
Yeah. And I think to add to that, you've been new before, and you've survived.
Zovig Garboushian
Yes! And you lived to tell the tale and no one died. It was great.
Kim Meninger
Sometimes we forget, like you were born a marketing director, right? Like you weren't born, that you end up stepping into that feels scary in that moment. You this the steps that got you there were once new and scary, too. [Right.] And we tend to isolate the one the current situation, as opposed to zooming out and saying, oh, here we go again, right? Yeah, I know. It's gonna be comfortable. I don't love this time. But it comes with the territory. And I know I have the resources, I need to handle it.
Zovig Garboushian
Right. Right. But that's really positive self-talk. And that's really honoring yourself instead of breaking yourself down. It's amazing to me how quickly we can jump to conclusions about ourselves that are not positive. Yeah, it's really, it's really astounding to me that we can do that to ourselves. And yet, there's, there's so much good that we can say about who we are. And look, we're not perfect. I got news for every person who might listen to this. You're not perfect. You're gonna screw it up. You're gonna make mistakes, and everyone will survive and it will be fine. It will be fine. You will learn a lot. I learned a lot every time I make mistakes. I try not to I don't want to, but it also doesn't diminish who I am.
Kim Meninger
Yeah, yeah. And I find that you know, when you think about it from the perspective of your nervous system, the more you're afraid of making a mistake, the more likely you are to make a mistake.
Zovig Garboushian
Right? You're so right. You're so right. I can count so many times where I was so scared trying not to make a mistake, and then I messed it up anyway.
Kim Meninger
Yeah, you’re, you're not in the part of your brain that makes clear choices when you're in that state of constant fear. And yeah, oh my gosh, so big. This is such an amazing conversation. I could stay here all day.
Zovig Garboushian
Thank you.
Kim Meninger
I know that you do this work and I want you to share with people who might be thinking I want more of her where they can find you.
Zovig Garboushian
Yeah, yeah, so you can find me a few places first, you can find me on LinkedIn just my name is Zovig Garboushian. And you can find me on my two websites boldnessablazecoaching.com and the other is zovig.com. One is for executive coaching and one is for speaking and training. I met either one you can find me either. And I love to connect. I play a lot around on LinkedIn. So I love to connect there. So Please reach out and get in touch with me.
Kim Meninger
Wonderful and I'll put those links in the show notes as well thank you again Zovig this has been…
Zovig Garboushian
Thank you, thank you, Kim. It was a pleasure.